[quote]roben (11/08/2010)[hr]And FYI…
The documentry ‘Unfit2Fight’ that he is doing is putting all proceeds and helping to raise awareness to a charity whos cause is against violent crime on the streets.[/quote]
i have an idea lets promote mindless violence then we can film it and sell it and then give the proceeds to anti violence charities to combat street violence … thats gotta be the best one yet !;
besides don’t you think its a little weird to watch grown men rolling about with each others crotches on each other faces
sorry roben i removed this
Have to agree with egg its a little Homoerotic to watch.
hahaha egg 
ok ok i see your point and yeah i do agree, like i said i’m not that into MMA for that reason, more of the stand up type of martial arts. Although Ju Jitsu and judo is really fascinating.
But you’ve slightly missed the point of by a mark, let me explain here:
Martial Arts teaches you discipline, it teaches respect and it also teaches you to be humble, not to mention to be able to defend yourself.
If you ever meet a true martial artist (true that in MMA and other martial arts there are a few sluggers who are exemption to this) you’ll find they are very peaceful and would much rather talk a confrontation down, rather than to resort to violence.
Martial artists have a great deal of respect and would rather not fight if they didn’t have too. I know it may not seem like that from the outside, but ask any martial artist, i’m actually hoping someone else here will also back me up on this.
People don’t take up martial arts to cause violence and harm to people, they do it for the sport, the fitness and even to defend themselves.
Let me tell you about my background, I had an alcoholic father and he would cause a lot of problems for me as a child, this in turn caused me to be a very nervous child at school. Kids would pick up on that and throughout my whole schooling time, even when i moved schools from Scotland to Devon, it still carried on, I was bullied non stop for many many years.
Even out of school i’d get picked on.
Once when I was 16 i was just coming out of the Bowling Centre with my friend and got jumped on my 5-10 lads (too busy trying not to get my face too smashed in to count)
You can imagine at this point, my whole life being constantly beaten up and picked on, my brain snapped, i got fed up of it, so I took up martial arts.
Honestly ever since, i’ve never had trouble, i never used to tell people about my martial arts for fear of people wanting to start on me ‘because i did martial arts’, you know like some idiot who’s had a bit to drink maybe shouting at me “you’re that one who does muay thai arn’t you, you think you’re the big man? I recon i could have you blah blah”. I didn’t want that so i never told anyone.
Anyways I never got problems, why? Because martial arts taught me to hold myself better and be more confident in myself, that in turn psychologically portrays across. Just like how being nervous and insecure psychologically attracts people to attack you, being more confident etc psychologically blocks people from wanting to attack you. You don’t even have to say anything. Body language is a big thing and everyone portrays themselves from their body language. Check out psychology sometime it’s really fascinating stuff actually :).
Anyways even now, even if someone did try to attack i’d always much much rather not resort to violence, even every person I’ve trained with or know who trains say the same thing.
Now sparring and ring matches are different, there is no animosity, i’ve done a handful of ring fights before but we did it as sport and there was no hard feelings after, we’d have a laugh, a handshake / hug and all good friends, there’s respect with each other and in the sport.
There is a BIG difference from that and mindless street aggression.
I’m at something of a loss at what to say to egg and even Jon here. Regardless of whether or not you like/appreciate/hate/find it exciting/find it boring, or whatever, you cannot in any way call MMA “mindless” violence. It’s certainly far from mindless. There’s an awful lot of technique and tactics involved in it. Just like any other martial art.
BTW - the aim of it is to beat the other person, you don’t aim to injure or kill them. Much the same as in other full contact martial arts, such as boxing, Vale Tudo, Kyokushinkai Karate, Olympic Taekwondo, K-1, kickboxing, Thai Boxing and so on.
And yes, I’m a martial artist. Have been for 30 years. Would I compete in an MMA match? Perhaps, if I were a LOT younger.
I’ve rolled with Brazilian jiu-jitsu guys and what might look like to you, mindless scrabbling on the floor, is in fact a seriously considered dual of leverage and physical chess. I’m pretty competent generally but struggled to match the BJJ guys on the ground, often finding myself pinned or locked. So, yes, there’s an awful lot of skill involved in every martial art, inc MMA.
Im sorry to hear that you were a victim of bullying roben and that **** with your dad is ****ty so im sorry if i got you riled with this i didnt mean to touch a nerve ... not my style .peace :)
[quote]jonsloan (11/08/2010)[hr]I’m at something of a loss at what to say to egg and even Jon here. Regardless of whether or not you like/appreciate/hate/find it exciting/find it boring, or whatever, you cannot in any way call MMA “mindless” violence. It’s certainly far from mindless. There’s an awful lot of technique and tactics involved in it. Just like any other martial art.
BTW - the aim of it is to beat the other person, you don’t aim to injure or kill them. Much the same as in other full contact martial arts, such as boxing, Vale Tudo, Kyokushinkai Karate, Olympic Taekwondo, K-1, kickboxing, Thai Boxing and so on.
And yes, I’m a martial artist. Have been for 30 years. Would I compete in an MMA match? Perhaps, if I were a LOT younger.
I’ve rolled with Brazilian jiu-jitsu guys and what might look like to you, mindless scrabbling on the floor, is in fact a seriously considered dual of leverage and physical chess. I’m pretty competent generally but struggled to match the BJJ guys on the ground, often finding myself pinned or locked. So, yes, there’s an awful lot of skill involved in every martial art, inc MMA.[/quote]
in the video posted the guy clearly states his personal intention to do harm and retire the other guy and this is the case in almost every UFC fight.
You’ve completely missed my point, all the sport you have mention i agree are great sports that take a lot of skill but that’s not what you are viewing when you view MMA or UFC these companies tag these sports onto the fighters to make mindless violence into a so called sport.
[quote]jon_fisher (11/08/2010)[hr][quote]jonsloan (11/08/2010)[hr]I’m at something of a loss at what to say to egg and even Jon here. Regardless of whether or not you like/appreciate/hate/find it exciting/find it boring, or whatever, you cannot in any way call MMA “mindless” violence. It’s certainly far from mindless. There’s an awful lot of technique and tactics involved in it. Just like any other martial art.
BTW - the aim of it is to beat the other person, you don’t aim to injure or kill them. Much the same as in other full contact martial arts, such as boxing, Vale Tudo, Kyokushinkai Karate, Olympic Taekwondo, K-1, kickboxing, Thai Boxing and so on.
And yes, I’m a martial artist. Have been for 30 years. Would I compete in an MMA match? Perhaps, if I were a LOT younger.
I’ve rolled with Brazilian jiu-jitsu guys and what might look like to you, mindless scrabbling on the floor, is in fact a seriously considered dual of leverage and physical chess. I’m pretty competent generally but struggled to match the BJJ guys on the ground, often finding myself pinned or locked. So, yes, there’s an awful lot of skill involved in every martial art, inc MMA.[/quote]
in the video posted the guy clearly states his personal intention to do harm and retire the other guy and this is the case in almost every UFC fight.
You’ve completely missed my point, all the sport you have mention i agree are great sports that take a lot of skill but that’s not what you are viewing when you view MMA or UFC these companies tag these sports onto the fighters to make mindless violence into a so called sport.[/quote]
I do agree to an extent, it’s kinda marketed off that way but it’s certainly not the intention by a lot of the fighers.
Don’t forget the video was staged, it’s much similar to american wrestling in that respect, just something to latch onto, makes things a little more interesting but you know it’s not ‘real’.
oh and i’ve never seen a man stop punching or kicking when another man is on the floor either unconscious or unable to defend himself with out the ref having to step in while watching MMA or UFC
WHERE IS THE SPORT IN THAT
Hey Jon, I didn’t watch the video but it’s irrelevant to any broader discussion about MMA. You have to separate the TV hype from the reality and it’s not fair to make sweeping statements about his attitude being typical of all MMA fighters as it most certainly isn’t.
Take two current UFC champions, George St. Pierre and Anderson Silva. Both come from traditional MA backgrounds and both now compete exclusively in MMA. Both are very respectful, very technical and very interesting fighters.
Silva fought and almost lost at the weekend. He spent nearly five rounds being overwhelmed by his opponent who had, to be fair, done a lot of trash talking in the fight’s lead up. At the end, after tapping him, Silva went to the guy and knelt and bowed before him. Totally respectful.
Pre-fight hype is a load of hot air and does not typify the mindset of most fighters. It’s part of the ‘show’.
I’ve seen a lot worse attitudes and displays of unnecessary aggression from traditional martial artists at semi or no-contact tournaments. An individual does not represent a style or system, he only represents him or herself.
[quote]jonsloan (11/08/2010)[hr]Hey Jon, I didn’t watch the video but it’s irrelevant to any broader discussion about MMA. You have to separate the TV hype from the reality and it’s not fair to make sweeping statements about his attitude being typical of all MMA fighters as it most certainly isn’t.
Take two current UFC champions, George St. Pierre and Anderson Silva. Both come from traditional MA backgrounds and both now compete exclusively in MMA. Both are very respectful, very technical and very interesting fighters.
Silva fought and almost lost at the weekend. He spent nearly five rounds being overwhelmed by his opponent who had, to be fair, done a lot of trash talking in the fight’s lead up. At the end, after tapping him, Silva went to the guy and knelt and bowed before him. Totally respectful.
Pre-fight hype is a load of hot air and does not typify the mindset of most fighters. It’s part of the ‘show’.
I’ve seen a lot worse attitudes and displays of unnecessary aggression from traditional martial artists at semi or no-contact tournaments. An individual does not represent a style or system, he only represents him or herself.[/quote]
ok there’s always going to be an exception to the rule but a large percentage are there for the blood lust only. i’ve watched it many times and completely got turned off by the fact that the ref has to jump in and stop these guys a huge amount of the time.
if these guys were fighting in a none MMA fight they would never continue to smash there opponent into the ground, a judo fighter would never back heal his opponent in the face just to better his chances of scoring a point.
[quote]jonsloan (11/08/2010)[hr]Hey Jon, I didn’t watch the video but it’s irrelevant to any broader discussion about MMA. You have to separate the TV hype from the reality and it’s not fair to make sweeping statements about his attitude being typical of all MMA fighters as it most certainly isn’t.
Take two current UFC champions, George St. Pierre and Anderson Silva. Both come from traditional MA backgrounds and both now compete exclusively in MMA. Both are very respectful, very technical and very interesting fighters.
Silva fought and almost lost at the weekend. He spent nearly five rounds being overwhelmed by his opponent who had, to be fair, done a lot of trash talking in the fight’s lead up. At the end, after tapping him, Silva went to the guy and knelt and bowed before him. Totally respectful.
Pre-fight hype is a load of hot air and does not typify the mindset of most fighters. It’s part of the ‘show’.
I’ve seen a lot worse attitudes and displays of unnecessary aggression from traditional martial artists at semi or no-contact tournaments. An individual does not represent a style or system, he only represents him or herself.[/quote]
Well said Jonsloan!!!
I guess its fair to say that if you talk about UFC or MMA you will always get two sides, personally i would rather watch all of these sports in there own places and don’t feel that i would ever truly class UFC or MMA as a sport.
[quote]
ok there’s always going to be an exception to the rule but a large percentage are there for the blood lust only. i’ve watched it many times and completely got turned off by the fact that the ref has to jump in and stop these guys a huge amount of the time.
if these guys were fighting in a none MMA fight they would never continue to smash there opponent into the ground, a judo fighter would never back heal his opponent in the face just to better his chances of scoring a point.
[/quote]
Jon, “a large percentage” that’s a sweeping generalisation again. It’s fine that you don’t like it. I’m not trying to convert you to being a fan, just to realise it’s not fair to generalise about it.
To be fair, I’ve seen a LOT of boxing matches where one fighter continues to hit his opponent after the bell or ref stops the fight.
You have to understand what happens psychologically when you fight. You enter what is sometimes referred to as ‘condition black’ (this applies to everyone not just MMA ppl).
In that state of mind, your BPM will can be over 180, at which point your ability to perform complex motor skills deteriorates, you lose peripheral vision, suffer a loss of depth perception, loss of near vision and suffer auditory dysfunction.
All of which results in tunnel vision and some temporary level of deafness. So, continuing to strike after the bell/ref is more common than you would think and has less to do with aggression than it does with a psychological/physiological response to a heightened emotional state.
There are some fighters though who are too aggressive and want to hurt their opponent, even if that desire is sometimes only fleeting. But that doesn’t mean that’s how the majority of fighters approach combat.
BTW - I think I am right in remembering that statistically judo has one of the highest injury rates of any combat sport.
[/quote]
To be fair, I've seen a LOT of boxing matches where one fighter continues to hit his opponent after the bell or ref stops the fight.
[/quote]
Possibly if two men are fighting you'll see a ref step in before one gets hurt but hitting a collapsed boxer or an unconscious boxer never.
sorry i've seen that once from Rocky Marciano when he threw a punch after the other guy was on his knee
Quick (2 minutes) bit of YouTube-ing
Bad behaviour in boxing
[url]boxin late punch - YouTube
[url]Boxer Goes Insane! - YouTube
[url]Cheap Shot Ends Boxing Match Loser is NOT Happy - YouTube
[url]Sucker Punch - YouTube
Let’s not forget the Tyson biting incident.
Even then, that doesn’t make all boxing/boxers bad people. Ditto MMA fighters.
ok well howards just informed me that there are more rules now to MMA fights that are there to protect the fighters
[quote]jonsloan (11/08/2010)[hr]Quick (2 minutes) bit of YouTube-ing
Bad behaviour in boxing
[url]boxin late punch - YouTube
Let’s not forget the Tyson biting incident.
Even then, that doesn’t make all boxing/boxers bad people. Ditto MMA fighters.[/quote]
isnt that fight mma ?
hah, told you it was quick! :w00t:
Looks like K-1, not strictly MMA in the sense Jon’s talking about though. More kickboxing. I’m pretty sure all the others are boxing though.
The point is that it happens in all contact sports from time to time. I wouldn’t categorise MMA for being particularly prone to it though.
The first was MMA (i watched the fight)
2nd Ok but this isn’t a fighter and a fighter this was one man and his obvious problem with a refs decision, totally disrespectful but at least he was put in prison for his actions.
The third was a not that bad naughty but not like he pummeled him, one punch and the ref had stopped the fight. the guys actions after were not called for.
and 4th was a totally legal punch. although i will give you the fact that the guy was not fit to carry on and the fighter should have seen that.
Tyson was a scum bag that did nothing, spent his career fighting bums and past their best fighters.