There has been lots of discussion on various forums about the quality of the sound engine of Ableton live vs other DAWs such as Logic - which is regarded as having a very high quality. In fact Villelobos made a comment recently about Live having low quality - although most agree his comment seems pretty vague and unfounded.
Anyways the argument is that due to Live being originally and continually designed with being used in a Live context - certain audio engine processes are compiled to be good for live (response and stability - things like sample rate conversion) but perhaps sacrificing absolute quality.
My opinion is that this toxic rumour was a result of Pre Live 7 level overload issues, people using warping when it was not needed and general improper gain staging between plugins.
However there is still a large amount of users who say Live mix buss ‘craps out’ or becomes overloaded easily when mixing projects…although with little evidence other than anecdotal…
My question is for the guys of Sonic Academy who regularly use Live, Logic and Cubase - what are your thoughts on this?
Well I always bounce down and do my final mix in Cubase - well actually now I use Reaper - but that’s mainly because the mixer etc… is far better laid out in Reaper/Cubase/Logic. Actually the mixer is the one really annoying thing about ableton.
As for Quality, i’m not 100% convinced that the sound engine is as poor as people make out - i’d be keen to see how it compared in a-b tests.
I use cubase for final mixes on projects… i bounce out the stems from ableton and do final arranging and mixing in cubase.
I think its less about the engine and more about the nicer layout for arranging and mixing in cubase.
although i think cubase does sound better when summing tracks for whatever reason.
i have no idea why it does but logic just sounds better.
even rewire ableton in logic or cubase and only use the main out puts you’ll notice a difference in sound. its the same with reason.
Cubase, Logic, Pro tools just sound better
From what i understand, Logic has one of the best (if not the best) sound engine out of all of the DAW’s. Thats why its a staple in the music industry. However, dont get turned off to Live by this. I know of many producers who make all their work in Ableton and release it. As well as Reason. As well as Pro Tools. As well as Cubase. As well as Logic.
In other words. Use what you like the best.
I read that Ableton wasn’t built orginally for live performance, it just became a good tool for that and thus, was adapted.
Anyways like Howie said, don’t let any of this put you off Ableton. It still got voted 2nd best DAW 2009 by Future Music, after Logic.
[quote]roben (01/03/2010)[hr]I read that Ableton wasn’t built orginally for live performance, it just became a good tool for that and thus, was adapted.
Anyways like Howie said, don’t let any of this put you off Ableton. It still got voted 2nd best DAW 2009 by Future Music, after Logic.[/quote]
wasn’t live originally stienberg remix and cost only £19.99
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51YF0GX420L._SL500_AA280_.jpg
before the idea was sold, i think steinberg owned recycle too before they sold that to propeller heads
[quote]roben (01/03/2010)[hr] It still got voted 2nd best DAW 2009 by Future Music, after Logic.[/quote]
Future Music - one of the weakest sources in terms of credibility…their tables merely reflect the latest new thing and almost everything gets some type of award…
But I do agree that there probably isnt a huge difference and better get on with music…
I might try Harrison Mixbus tho for my final mixdown…and compare…
[quote]SWAN808 (01/03/2010)[hr][quote]roben (01/03/2010)[hr] It still got voted 2nd best DAW 2009 by Future Music, after Logic.[/quote]
Future Music - one of the weakest sources in terms of credibility…their tables merely reflect the latest new thing and almost everything gets some type of award…[/quote]
I agree, as well as I think that they base alot of thier positive reviews on their advertising clients. It’s funny that if you pay attention that the products in their reviews that get more of the top marks are the ones that have advertisements in their magazine.
SHADY!!!
Thats why I only read that magazine for face value and never quote anything I read from there. Its not too reliable.
[quote]SWAN808 (01/03/2010)[hr][quote]roben (01/03/2010)[hr] It still got voted 2nd best DAW 2009 by Future Music, after Logic.[/quote]
Future Music - one of the weakest sources in terms of credibility…their tables merely reflect the latest new thing and almost everything gets some type of award…
But I do agree that there probably isnt a huge difference and better get on with music…
I might try Harrison Mixbus tho for my final mixdown…and compare…[/quote]
So you’re denying Live 8 as being worthy of 2nd place out of all the DAWs?
I’d personally agree with it, even if i am more of a Live 8 than Logic fan.
Each to their own.
[quote]roben (02/03/2010)[hr][quote]SWAN808 (01/03/2010)[hr][quote]roben (01/03/2010)[hr] It still got voted 2nd best DAW 2009 by Future Music, after Logic.[/quote]
Future Music - one of the weakest sources in terms of credibility…their tables merely reflect the latest new thing and almost everything gets some type of award…
But I do agree that there probably isnt a huge difference and better get on with music…
I might try Harrison Mixbus tho for my final mixdown…and compare…[/quote]
So you’re denying Live 8 as being worthy of 2nd place out of all the DAWs?
I’d personally agree with it, even if i am more of a Live 8 than Logic fan.
Each to their own.[/quote]
to be honest - I dont think you can rank DAWs. The top DAWs are all good and they can serve a different purpose. Cubase, Reaper, Pro Tools, Logic, Live - even lesser ones - Samplitude, FL Studio - all have their strengths and weaknesses…for instance - for electronic music composistion Live clearly is my top. But for mixing and multitrack recording something like Pro Tools or Reaper might be preferable. Cubase and Logic are a reasonable ‘in between’…but quite bloated as a result…
I guess you could argue that Logic is tops because of the huge value for money - but it can be buggy as hell…and many are angry with its development pace and Apple does not treat is userbase of professionals well…
you wouldnt record a band with ableton, more likely to use something else as it’s not really made for it
each daw has it’s strengths, ableton certainly does have a sound to some degree but i think a lot of time that’s down to how people are using warping
regarding the villalobos comments, he actually uses a ghost producer so i wouldn’t take too much notice of him
at the end of the day if it’s working for you, then there is no reason to question it