Hi All.
I figured out a compression trick a few weeks ago and have been using it constantly and I wanted to share it with you all. This tip/trick is related to sidechain compression.
I'm not sure if others do this... but its a neat trick and I am sure there are people that dont..
Here it goes...
Normally as most know you setup your bassline to sidechain to your kick drum. As it has been explained countless times on here, it gives your bass line that groove sound and allows the bass & the kick to live inside the same space and work together in your track.
A problem I noticed though was that if you drop the kick out and continue the bass the sidechain effect disappears since the kick is no longer playing. This is OK sometimes, but it can kind of mess with your track a bit. If the sound you synthesized is really rooted with the sidechain then you wind up loosing the feel in your track.
Here is my solution...
Create your drums as you normally would. Perfect your kick to the point where you feel that it is as it will remain for the rest of the track. THEN, once you are satisfied with your kick, Duplicate the kick drum track (impulse or drum machine) and turn off the output. This way you still only have 1 kick playing in the output but a 2nd kick track that is also feeding a signal to your DAW. In ableton this is easy to do, just click the little yellow button on the track session and you will see the bar moving while the track is playing but no sound is coming out from the track. You can do this in cubase & logic as well.
Now that you have your 2nd kick track output turned off, whenever you need to sidechain another sound or effect to the kick choose your KICK2 track instead of your first kick track to sidechain that sound to. This way when your kick drops out you keep your same sidechain effect to the bassline or whatever sound you apply it to without the kick drum playing. This can be really cool for breakdowns in trance or house because it allows your track to maintain the same groove/feel from the start.
Now obviously if you dont WANT to keep the sidechain effect for a sound when the kick drops out then you should definitely sidechain that sound to your 1st kick track so that when the kick drops out you also loose the sidechain effect.
Give it a try and lemme know what you think. I think it really adds 2 the grove doing it this way. Plus its an easy and simple fix to do some pretty cool stuff. For instance you could have the drums drop out (except the kick 2 track) and then play with some automation to increase the ratio of the compression on a sound during a fill and get some pretty interesting results.
Just wanted 2 share that with you all because I thought it was a cool thing to learn!
What I have been doing lately is just duplicating my kick and then having the 2nd kick play the entire track (with the output turned off) so that at any given time you have access to a sidechain effect during the track. Works great for breakdowns.
enjoy!
Mate this is not a tip it’s called making a sidechain trigger track… No seriouse producer uses their actuall kick to sidechain pretty much everyone will make a trigger track and alot don’t even use a kick sample for it they use a sharp closed high hat.
yar. i figured there were others that did this. listening to some records I love I could hear it being done.
i guess its only a tip 2 newbies then because almost every vid you watch is about sidechaining to your kick and I never saw this done in any of the videos i’ve watched.
[quote]UnitedVision (10/09/2010)[hr]yar. i figured there were others that did this. listening to some records I love I could hear it being done.
i guess its only a tip 2 newbies then because almost every vid you watch is about sidechaining to your kick and I never saw this done in any of the videos i’ve watched.[/quote]
Its fine dude! I too have done this for a long time. Lemme give you another tip to go along with that. Bounce the trigger track to audio. This way, you save processing power as well. Thank you for sharing though dude! More then I can say for others here. 
[quote]jjdejong0 (10/09/2010)[hr]Mate this is not a tip it’s called making a sidechain trigger track… No seriouse producer uses their actuall kick to sidechain pretty much everyone will make a trigger track and alot don’t even use a kick sample for it they use a sharp closed high hat.[/quote]
what? that’s just silly, why would you side chain bass to a hi-hat, when you want it to work with a kick? kick envelope is rather different to hi hat, so why would you make more work for yourself?
also this question came up many times and I’m sure that many people on here will find it useful!
I dont think its very helpful to say ‘that isnt a tip’ or that ‘serious producers blah…’
That tip will defo be handy to lots of people. It has uses for other things too, using to trigger all sorts of things, gates and filters etc.
You can expand on it lots, and everyone works differently and therfore comes across things in different orders.
I wouldnt want to put anyone off sharing things like this for sure.
You could also use a sine with a gate on it and use a sound to trigger the sine for instant subby techno kicks
[quote]seanl (10/09/2010)[hr][quote]jjdejong0 (10/09/2010)[hr]Mate this is not a tip it’s called making a sidechain trigger track… No seriouse producer uses their actuall kick to sidechain pretty much everyone will make a trigger track and alot don’t even use a kick sample for it they use a sharp closed high hat.[/quote]
what? that’s just silly, why would you side chain bass to a hi-hat, when you want it to work with a kick? kick envelope is rather different to hi hat, so why would you make more work for yourself?
also this question came up many times and I’m sure that many people on here will find it useful![/quote]
I think what is meant by this is that some producers use a hi-hat sample, playing a four on the floor pattern as their sidechain trigger, or by using a kick with a very short decay. Sean Tyas for example swears by this method. Certain kick drums transients and wave forms can be a bit iffy and actually cause a sidechain compressor to trigger more than once per beat.
[quote]seanl (10/09/2010)[hr][quote]jjdejong0 (10/09/2010)[hr]Mate this is not a tip it’s called making a sidechain trigger track… No seriouse producer uses their actuall kick to sidechain pretty much everyone will make a trigger track and alot don’t even use a kick sample for it they use a sharp closed high hat.[/quote]
what? that’s just silly, why would you side chain bass to a hi-hat, when you want it to work with a kick? kick envelope is rather different to hi hat, so why would you make more work for yourself?
also this question came up many times and I’m sure that many people on here will find it useful![/quote]
i have to say that it is done regular i thought it was a silly idea too until someone pointed out that if you want the click of the kick you want to pop through when side chaining use a hatish sound
Nice effort though U.V
all good guys.
for someone like myself that has only been doing this for a few months... it was cool 2 learn.
i was sure that others on here already knew about it or were doing something similar.
but there are plenty of people on this forum that are NOT that far along. so i shared.
i'm definitely going to do expand on it using howie's trick and bouncing it to audio.
also if tyas is doing the hi-hat thing... its gotta be worth checking it out. will try it later.
using hi-hats is for pussies 
I def do this on all my tracks but I hadn’t heard about using hats as the trigger track sample. Interesting idea. I’ll have to try it.
Benefit of a SC’d hat is that it is very Fast (All Attack) & Short.
Compressor can / could react too slow if your Kick is too long. If you are just copying over a Silent Kick for your SC Input, you probably wont change the envelope on it. I never did tbh.
Shorter SC Input gives you more control over release IMO.
I use one instead of a Kick & its definitely more responsive than a Kick. Try it for the buzz. Theres more than one way to skin a Cat.
Besides, I like Pussies 
I know…I know…just kidding! Obviously you can use either, depending on a effect you after. I like mine sidechained to a kick for a smoother response, but then again you can get the same effect using hold/knee on a hihat.
I tend to use sidechain on all of my tracks, however I tend to use a different kick to my main one, something short and punchy, I also use a short decay so the volume/compression on the compresser comes back up to full level in time for next kick coming in. I dont just use sidechain on my bass but also on pads, FX’s, plucks, leads and hihat etc as well as my return tracks depending on what I’m trying to do.
I will also change the attack and release on the compressor to get different sidechain effect. Sometimes I also like a smooth sidechain on my strings for example with a faster more pumping one on my base which this helps with.
Another cool thing to do is have a long delay return track which is sidechained with a automated filter on it for cool fx’s on sweeps etc.
Some tips and idea’s for anyone new to sidechaining - go give it a shot!
you can use the EQ section on the sidechain to altr the release tim of your kick no need for a hi-hat just put a hi-pass on the sidechain.
also is one of the cool things about sidechainig that you get the big effect of your kick sucking out the bass or pads when the kick drops simulating the natural limter effect your ears do when something is really loud which is what creates the excitement?
defo usefull to use a seperate trigger track for some hats and percussion.
I record my farts and then use them as a trigger for my sidechain. Its extra work and somewhat embarrasing when you get caught with a mic up your *** when recording but it gives your tracks a fresh breath of life . you can also do kicks or hi hats depending on what you eat a hour or two before recording sessions. i can do a youtube vid for you guys if you want
I do apologise I don’t wana put anyone off sharing anything I guess I just didn’t realize how many people just used their acuall kick I was under the impression everyone used a trigger track as in most sequencers excluding ableton you NEED a trigger track. Also using a hihat as your trigger is not silly as you wan the sharp attack for triggering your compression. Also alot of people will just use the same kick that is playing but shorten the decay. You want your main kick to be big and punchy and reach the whole frequency spectrum including the click in the upper range this in turn does not make for a very pleasent trigger. Also it doesn’t waste time it actually saves time, as if you use your kick you will have to do more tweaking on your acuall compressor. If you use a hi hat all you really need to do is lower the threshold and se it to Ff1. I didn’t know Sean tyas used this method but the proof is in the pudding he’s not exactly an ‘average’ producer is he. I also read somewhere in a mag that Deadmau5 has a series of samples tha are just different clicks. It’s hard to explain it just makes everything a bit cleaner. But I do apologise if I sounded harsh I was just completely under the impression that everyone used a trigger track. I mean come on say you have a pad playing along sidechained to your kick and it’s playing along nicely then bang! Your break hits the kick is gone and your pad goes from playing along nicely to just blaring out you can’t convince me this abrupt change is pleasent and is surely a bit crappy sounding?
Good tips lads, I only found out about this a couple of days ago when I watched a video on youtube of Steve Angello in the studio, that bloke is a sick producer. So thanks for sharing
or you could draw in volume envelopes for a sidechain effect, ultimate control
i tend not to bother with this as i just want to get on with things and am lazy at the later stages 