hello every one 
This is my first post on this amazing site, and I curious to know what is you opinion about a little thing
I wanted to know what do you think about combining loops (that came from packs for example) in the track you produce? do you think its a okey to do it? or you think its kind of stealing? I mean I feel like a little cheater when using it because I didnt make it?
do you think many artists on beat port use it? (techno, minimal, minimal house geners)
please tell me what you think???
Depends on the license that came with the sample pack, but generally speaking, if you bought it, you can use it. I personally don’t think it’s cheating, and find that using a loop or sample can really help break a creative block sometimes. Just don’t go making another Knas.
what is knas?
[quote]baba_anubis (13/01/2012)[hr]hello every one
This is my first post on this amazing site, and I curious to know what is you opinion about a little thing
I wanted to know what do you think about combining loops (that came from packs for example) in the track you produce? do you think its a okey to do it? or you think its kind of stealing? I mean I feel like a little cheater when using it because I didnt make it?
do you think many artists on beat port use it? (techno, minimal, minimal house geners)
please tell me what you think???[/quote]
i see nothing wrong with using a loop every now and then.
refer to the chris agnelli vids were he talks about presets and loops. he’s totally cool with it and he is certainly one of the best trance producers around!! even cooler were he puts it in the track!
just put in a nice little hi hat loop loop in my track and it has certainly added a nice element.
all i would say is to not have your whole track full of loops… you certainly want some originality
If your really worried about loops and are using Ableton one thing you can do is extract the groove. That way you can throw the loop down in MIDI form and add your own variation (though this means you need to have a loop which is made up of a single element/remove the unnecessary bits).
You can then even tweak the shuffle, change the velocities and do things like that?
However, you cant use this for things like melodies cause extracting the groove puts all the notes on C1 I think? You can, however, use melodyne to do it for melodies (if you own it, I REEALLY WANT IT MYSELF!).
Artists big and small use loops all the time. Sometimes from sample packs, sometimes from old records they’ve lifted them from
[url]http://www.whosampled.com/[/url]
That is a great site for going through tracks and seeing where parts came from. BIG artists on there.
Some people will have a dig if you do, but they’re just being elitist. As for Steve Angello’s KNAS, yes he took a melody loop from a sample pack and made a good track from it. So what? It’s still a good track.
[url]http://www.beatportal.com/feed/item/steve-angellos-knas-made-easy[/url]
Do whatever helps you to make great music.
No offense but saying dont go making another Knas is the worst advise ive ever heard. Fact is that track showed what can be done with basically just samples and it went to no1 on beatport. I love all the people that rage about it, fact is everyone hd access to those samples and only 1 person made track out of it and it was a big hit.
Also back to the main question why would it be cheating using loops? Thats what they are there for, thats what you pay your money for.
Whilst I agree that loops are good to use I do think that KNAS was sad…
I dont see how someone can use only samples and say its his track. Obviously he structured it but that track should be called Steve Angello feat. Vengeance - KNAS.
Same applies to some singers who really need to start accrediting the producers, e.g. Examples Changed The Way You Kissed Me should definately have a feat Michael Woods.
Otherwise I have no problem in using loops extensively.
That and KNAS was WAAAY overhyped, it got Beatport no.1 cause its Steve Angello and thats it, the track is not that good…
And I dont give a rats *** about what he did to get the track when it comes to whether I like something or not, it could be a reversed track from someone else, if it sounded good im not gonna put it down just cause of the method used.
I only have issues with proper accreditation where accreditation is deserved…
I cannot agree with the Knas argument but I will agree with the Example argument. That definately should have been Michael Woods ft Example - Changed the way you kissed me.
[quote]jjdejong0 (15/01/2012)[hr]No offense but saying dont go making another Knas is the worst advise ive ever heard. Fact is that track showed what can be done with basically just samples and it went to no1 on beatport. I love all the people that rage about it, fact is everyone hd access to those samples and only 1 person made track out of it and it was a big hit.
Also back to the main question why would it be cheating using loops? Thats what they are there for, thats what you pay your money for.[/quote]
I don’t have a problem with Steve Angello going and making Knas. I just don’t think it’s a good idea for someone who may not be comfortable with using loops to make an entire track out of one.
Adam Freeland made an entire track from the same sample pack and he is an established producer / label owner.
For me it depends on what you do and how you do it, e.g. a lot of people use a percussion loop hear and there not to drive a track but to pad out the frequencies. Also house has its roots in sampling and looping disco music.
Your time might be better spent learning new skills but at the end of the day if it sounds good and people dance, who really gives a ****?
I started with music theory…then I ran into loopmasters.com and stopped lying to myself. I ditched music theory fast after after this thought.
I really dont care to be a musician nor would I ever claim to one. I just want to produce music I like, possibly make money off it, tour clubs and venues around the world. I’m pushing 30 and my dream to tour the world and getting my songs played out get killed by day. If I had as much enthusiasm for music theory as I have for loops I’d bang it out in a week but that sh!t is harder than chinese calculus. It would probably take me a year or 2 to fundamentally understand just the basics. Now here the kick. I’m dis-coordinated in ever which way. I cant tell from my left and right. Playing keys is nearly impossible. Watch me dance something like salsa or even a slow dance…you’d want to kick me in the face. I cant keep the rhythm and steps together. My eyes watered when I saw all these sample packs are available with a click.
Everyone has there own interpretation of EDM but to me its just a pattern with cool new edge sounds that pop in every 8-16 bars, a great melody to tie it together and that awesome drop we EDM heads yearn for. I could sit another 1-2 years and learn how to learn the basics of a synth(s) to create those cool sounds but I have no desire to sit around twisting knobs and tones to replicate my own kick, snare, bleep, wobble etc. I got down on one knee when I saw preset packs and packs that already emulate vintage or EXPENSIVE synths.
Here was my last thought. Its legal do, music has no boundaries and the most importantly the ratio. Liked by elitist : Liked by fans. Which do I care for more? Fans or my peers. I chose fans. Because for the most part could give 2 sh!ts how its made, let alone even ask how its made.
TL/DR Unless my brain decides treat music theory like the first level of tertis and possibly starts giving a sh!t about high horse djs/producers/audiophile nerds, the majority of my music will probably be loops.
I get what you mean djsrone, everyone wants to be the big guy at the top. But there is a reason for them being where they are (at least some of them anyway…).
I dont think anyone is telling you to stop using loops (I know my earlier post makes that suggestion, but its more to do with correct accreditation to a track) but to rely on them too much will result in a boring track.
People keep coming up with the KNAS argument but other than a little cool autopanning effect he uses here and there that track is boring.
By using a mix of different techniques, sampling included, you will have a better chance at producing a top track.
The best artists are not just good at throwing loops together in a certain order; they are good sound designers, good melody writers (unless we are talking trance), good at making sure the perc flows well, good mixers, so on so forth.
Dont spend too much time on things you dont want to spend too much time on, but ignoring them outright is also a bad idea if you do want to get to where it seems you want to get to.
Tbh you get a lot of these crazy elitist attitudes. For example the sample pack hate, people that are like omfg you cn totally tell that lead was made using Vanguard etc etc
To give a cool example of why i think they have no argument whatsoever is this. If you check out Loopmasters theres a big swedish house pack. In it theres a constructtion kit for a song which pretty much sounds exactly like SHM’s One. Now a guy somewhere in Holland has used only the riff which is pretty much a cold copy and he made a track with it. He made his own arrangement and added some stuff to it himself.
Now this track gets played A LOT in a club i go to and tbh the people frikin love it, they go mad and thats what its all about! Making music that gets people dancing.
Be jonest, how many people in the general clubbing/party going population kisten to a track and think omg this is my favourite track cos u can tell hes using a minimoog for his bass, or omg this melody is awesome just listen to how crisp his filter sounds or omg this song sucks cos he used x preset or y sample pack.
Well unfortunately the latter people do exist but dont worry there unambitious producers with crazy elitist attitudes and no lives.
Im not saying anyone is right or wrong. I was just pointing out what works for me. I sometimes feel people like me, that would love to make music with loops only, get looked down upon…hence they go around on forums asking if its ok. But sometimes its a troll looking to stir the pot. Eventually you get the standard answers…“learn music theory” “the best never loop” “its cheating” “I ONLY USE some LOOPS”<–that’s my favorite.
I just like to inject some truth to these type of questions. Maybe one day they’ll stop and people will realize that its a stupid argument and it adds nothing to the community beside hearing grandstanding elitist and that ole good saying “music is dead because X killed it”
Although my previous post makes me sound like a bonehead. I actually really do understand most music theory and techniques that make a good track. You do need some of that knowledge to build a track. It would be a tremendous help if I could crave out a melody with my old lil fingers. But in all honesty I cant. I leave it to pros…LOOPS! It may not be my melody or drumloop…but I can damn sure arrange, efx, and add that SR-one style to them!!!
dude its absolutely OK!!!
Making music is fundamentally an art and thus, whatever method you use to get inspired or creative is the right way!
ignore all the crap on the web about “real artists don’t use presents or loops”. its not only rubbish, its also silly. we all work differently and find our muse in different ways
the most important thing to remember is this: its not how you make your track that counts, all that matters is the end result and the effect it has on you and on others.
find your own way!
PS I watched an interview with Armin Van Buuren about a year ago talking about how he not only uses loops and presents, but actually has a full-time sound designer design many, if not most, of his sounds - thus at times, he is not even creating the instrumentation but rather focusing on the arrangement
only the end result matters!
[quote]dorond (20/01/2012)[hr]dude its absolutely OK!!!
the most important thing to remember is this: its not how you make your track that counts, all that matters is the end result and the effect it has on you and on others.
[/quote]
This
i could not image doing tons of sound design throughout  my whole track. that would be a daunting task!!
i would never discount music theory though. i mean no matter what… EDM is music! the more i learn about music theory the better my tracks get!!