Kick 2 vs Vengeance Metrum comparison wanted

What’s good everyone! I hope all is well!
I thought I’d start a conversation/ topic of serious interest to me…
Kick 2 vs Vengeance Metrum! :smile:

With the new release of S.A. Kick 2, one can clearly tell that its a great plugin which will help simplify and fine tune one of the most important elements of any EDM track…, your kick drum! With so many kick drum plugins and variations/ styles on producing kicks, one can easily get confused or even over whelmed on which plugin to master especially being a noob to EDM music production.

My biggest challenge I’ve struggled through the years is getting the kick in tune with the fundamental key of the project which we all know is very critical. Making your kick sound tight with a strong presence and playing it in perfect harmony with the baseline yet punching through the mix is so important all before one moves any deeper into your project. I can’t tell you how many projects I have saved on my HD’s with just an 8-16 bar loop of a kick with a layered bass-lines and a small melody or arp looping over and over trying to get the kick to sit properly with project. Then you just end up saving that project never returning to it again. ( I actually have 100’s of these kick and bass loops) LOL…

Through years of trying different types of samples, synths and plugins…, I have personally decided to use and stick with Vengeance samples sets and their Metrum drum plugin to produce my drum kicks sounds. They have great quality… and I have gotten the most success compared to any other plugin, samples or drum synths that I’ve tried through out my years.

Now… with the release of S.A. Kick 2 and looking at a few videos of it, Kick 2 seems to be a much more serious plugin for producing your kicks and seems to share the same amount of editing features when compared to Vengeance Metrum.

To me, Metrum is an old plugin yet has been a head of its time by leaps and bounds and is truly underrated. I like (not love) using Metrum and had been the plugin of choice for my kick drums but it really needs an update especially simplifying the process of tuning the kick to the fundamental key and using all those little knobs within the plugin are tedious at times. My computer is a new iMac 5k and when I use Metrum, the buttons and other editing parameters knobs are so small due to the resolution of the iMac 5k so it easily becomes aggravating and tiering after a few minutes of use so one looses their motivation to produce with it. The sine wave synth in Metrum needs an update as-well as its a little difficult to get those sub frequencies for the low end of the kick. To get those sub frequencies I use in conjunction with Metrum another little plugin called Sasquatch Kick Machine to help get the punch for my kick. Together they worked great!

For those who have experience using Metrum and now have used the new Kick 2, can you chime in and make an honest comparison between these 2 plugins?
I would love to hear the Pro’s & Con’s between the two. To me, Metrum has tons of amazing features which are great and handy but when it comes to tuning the kick… its honestly a pain in the ass especially when changing in between presets. One tends to loose your creative ideas after spending so much time trying to get that right kick sound.

I wish there there was a feature were one can lock in on the fundamental key and switch through the presets with that key being locked on. Yet having a good warp engine that doesn’t cause artifacts within the sound of the kick.

What I really like about S.A. Kick 2 is the support behind the plugin which means a lot to a producer/composser and the supporting community behind the plugin. BTW! The customer support behind S.A. is TOP NOTCH so big up to S.A. and the crew… :wink:

As for Vengeance… LMAO… I have literally spent hundreds of dollars on Vengeance prouducts from samples, plugins and presets banks through my many years of music production and its hard to get good support from them ( reFX Nexus 2 not included). Vengeance doesn’t seem to update their products very often nor provide new presets or updates which one would expect if one pays top dollar on Vengeance products.
There is also a few bugs with some of Vengeance plugins that I own and have never been corrected. I email them my issues and never get any response back or simple one word answers. Where I can send S.A. a simple question and would get a response very quickly and at times within minutes. Thats amazing! I also know that S.A. listens to their customers for feedback. Try that with Vengeance. LMAO

So now before dropping my monies onto a new plugin such as Kick 2 and having to start a new learning curve with a new plugin that produces one of the most important aspects of EDM music ( your kick drum ),… I would really like to know if one can compare the 2 plugins with each other.
Regardless of it all… I’ll likely purchase Kick 2 and post a comparison video on Youtube to show the difference between the 2 plugins. But before I do I would like to hear the other S.A. forum members thoughts and encourage them to chime in and give their thought’s, suggestions or comments… on these 2 plugin instruments that are an extension of our art form… EDM music production.
I thought it would be a good forum conversation. SO I hope to hear form you all soon…:relieved:

Big Up to S.A. team! You guys are awesome!

-Pete One aka: Gami

Thanks for the big up!

I cant really speak for metrum as i havnt tried it yet. But i know that Kick 2 can make any kick that you can think of… and yes i would accept any challenge to recreate any kick samples you want to throw this direction. Im not just just being arrogant its just my experience with kick… I haven’t got stuck yet.

As for tuning your kick to your track… Im not really a wholehearted believer in this. In certain types of track this technique is useful ( Big Room EDM, some techno) but i actually find for a lot of work im doing tuning the kick is not much of a help. For Trance, D&B, progressive, house etc. I just make a slamming kick without worrying about tuning. Every track has its own needs and I focus on whats right for the track and don’t worry about what you are “supposed” to do. If it works it works. Thats just how I roll, everyone has their own approach.

We are a small team and care passionately about what we do/make so hopefully that comes across.

You should try the Kick 2 demo and see how you find it.


I have both Metrum and Kick 2.

Metrum excels at samples, Kick 2 excels at synthesis. Marry the two and your golden…
You now have over 1800 click samples from Metrum that can be loaded into kick 2!!!




Opps! Yes I ment Kick 2 :grin:

Do you happen to have any tutorials on this method?

You said metrum, you mean kick 2 right?

Kick 2 would be my first purchase of the two…



I thinking deciding to tune a kick comes down to if you want the down beat to have tone. And if it’s typical to have a longer kick with a tone in that genre.

If your kick is only half a beat there isn’t a great deal of time for the kick to settle on a fundamental note. It’s most likely still on a pitch trajectory or just settled on a tone but not long enough for it to be apparent. So no need to tune in this scenario. In this situation you should be focusing more on the attack, trasition and weight compared to your other elements I.e bass, percussion etc. And really just the vibe and how it feels with your eyes closed :wink:

If your kick is longer with an apparent tone then yeah you should think about getting it on the scale… Root note or 5ths as has already been mentioned both work. Although if the kick is a big action peice ala big room EDM use the root note and transpose everything until the kick AND bass both sound solid.

Another technique especially for trance is to have a pretty short kick and use a bass note for the tonality. This is how I prefer to do it. As if you have stuff with chord changes you are not worrying about stuff sounding weird.

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Sorry for the late reply… I got a new position working for the Federal Government here in the USA… F%#K Yeah!!! So I’ve been really busy these past few weeks…

But…! I finally got around to purchasing the Kick 2 plugin. After years of using Metrum… and now owning Kick 2, I must say that Sonic Academy NAILED it!

Quite a few differences between the two. But I must admit that Kick was a head of its time when released. Metrum is still a wicked plugin with deep editing but now having Kick 2 and comparing it to Metrum… I must say that I give Kick 2 the WIN…
I feel that Kick is right on point for the price range, sound and features. Its gotta be the best thus far when it comes to ease of use in comparison to Metrum.

The only complaint is the GUI detail. It honestly looks a little pixelated/ cheap looking when compared to other synths when you look at it for the first time. ( I use an iMac 5k running on Logic or Ableton so it the iMac shows a programs flaws easily). It has a little retro vibe to the look as if its been out for a few years already but its not bad.
I wish it had more visual detail in the interface/ GUI. Nicer buttons/ like real knobs and sharper more detailed materials with textured backgrounds and higher res imagery. Also having a nicer glow when buttons are activated (on) like when LED’s are light up on a real synth. Having a super HD look and feel for the latest 4K monitors could easily put this plugin on at the top of the charts. I can easily see Computer Music Magazine giving it a 10.
When compared to the price of Metrum, its not far behind in price range so I would expect a more professional look and feel just by staring at it. But its not bad by any means and I picked up at a discounted price so I’m happy…

I also wish it had a global lock to key button with a menu bar to choose what key to lock onto. This way one can scroll through presets at the key one would like for the project.

Sonic Academy has been awesome since I’ve joined the site and the Phil, Chis and Brian have been amazingly awesome… I just want to say keep up the awesome work… I could never imagine the amount of work that goes into making a program like Kick 2 for thousands of people around the world to use and make it their instrument of choice…

Look forward to a detailed comparison soon…
Now I gotta go and play with Kick 2 some more… :grin:

-Pete One AKA Gami

Good review… thanks!

Yeah we need to go retina GUI now for future plugs… might even do something for kick when we get a system in place

Whats good guys!
I hope all is well everyone! For me…, I’m still re-cooping from Hurricane Irma here in Florida…
Now that I’m back on my iMac 5k… I’ve been eager to make more music with Kick 2.
I thought it would be good to come back and update with my experience thus far using S.A. Kick 2 plugin. I love it!

I have to give it Sonic Academy and the team behind the KICK 2… You guys are dope! Kick 2 doesn’t stop impressing me. It has to be the best Kick Synth for EDM.
It’s my goto synth for Kicks… It use to be Vengeance Metrum. :grin:

As for being a Kick 2 user… There is something that Kick 2 seems to give more of when comparing the 2 plugins when making kicks. It just feels like more power and fullness when in comparison given the same volume. I feel like Metrum’s output lacks while Kick 2 pushes and can easily provide strong vibrant frequencies giving you a completeness when playing with the rest of your tracks/ projects.
You know that > Ahh-Haa moment when your scrolling through the presets folder looking for that right Kick and you find it or better yet it blends in perfectly into the song and you feel it.?! I get more of those moments when compared to Metrum… :smile:

Things I wish Kick 2 had:
-1st thing would be a high Resolution skin. On my iMac 5k the plugins fonts are a quite blurry. Using the iMac 5k the fonts are very sharp and you see detail in Logics Pro X GUI. Then when you click to use Kick 2, colors, fonts and the appearance scheme seems to blend in easily with the grey and black giving the plugin a Window’s XP OS feel… It feels a little bland and gets boring to look at after a while. I think giving the skin an appearance update ( Kind of like Spire did with their plugin skin updates ) this would be perfect.
-2nd More Presets libraries. Some of the presets are really weak and some strong. I have 5 different Volumes I’ve purchased and many presets fluctuate and vary in volume. Some presets are week and some come in strong. This is were Vengeance Metrum has the upper hand.
When Scrolling through presets Vengeance has more consistency in volume output were as Kick 2 has different volumes while scrolling preset to preset. Not a big issue but its noticeable.

I do like Vengeance Metrums frequency analyzer… having a live frequency viewer would be wicked inside the EQ window in Kick 2. :wink:
Giving the EQ a look and feel like Fabfilter would be sick!
OMG! Kick 2 with a Fabfilter interface… :scream:
Make Kick 2 more visually appealing with resizing options and GUI enhancements and I surely bet Kick 2 would be getting a 10/10 on Computer Music magazine.

Time to play with Kick 2…
I’ll be back
and keep up the outstanding work S.A. I love this site!

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Hi Phil ! I’m glad you said that about accepting a kick challenge. I’ve been trying hard to recreate the kick drum from Aghori by Manu Shrine using kick 2 but I can’t even get anywhere close. As far as I can work it Kick 2 cannot create kicks like this. Please prove me wrong !!!

PS - I have literally all of your presets but there is nothing similar for this kind of genre. Please could you release a preset pack with some kicks in this style?

Sure it could, technically and with the right attack sample on top… at least the basic body for it, but then again why bother. Its a heavily processed acoustic sample by the sounds of it. I’d just try and find a similar sample if it were me.

If you want to try recreate the body, try isolate a kick in that track… then grab visualiser like Vengeance Scope or Smexoscope. Its easy to ‘copy’ the waveform when you have a visual representation like that. Also, its often down to the amp envelopes of your kick rather than just pitch.

Aside from the body, look through acoustic samples. This actually sounds like one of the preset kits from battery 4. Most DAW’s would have a standard library which would probably contain something similar. I had a very quick listen, but you’re probably looking at applying a fair amount of distortion, probably some filtering and a reverb by the sounds of it along with EQ… a fair amount of boost in the low mids.