Just been watching the music theory vids and notice there is nothing mentioning sharp # key/scales.
If I start a tune in D# and make it a minor scale do all the same rules apply regarding triads (and everthing else like borrowed chords etc)?
Also I take it a whole tune dosent need to be it the same chord at the same time? ie I can have a pad with a minor chord and maybe a lead or stab sound on a major chord at the same time would this work or would it just sound confusing and crap?
Maybe a silly question but answers on a post card below please!
Thomas Bronzwaer - Collider (Jorn van Deynhoven Remix) uses this scale I think from ear and I’m trying to make something with the same feel/vibe but dont know pot about music theory… well am learning so if I apply all the theory stuff this this scale I should be able to get something with the same vibe right???
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[quote]gofunk (15/07/2010)[hr]Just been watching the music theory vids and notice there is nothing mentioning sharp # key/scales.
If I start a tune in D# and make it a minor scale do all the same rules apply regarding triads (and everthing else like borrowed chords etc)?[/quote]
yes. its the same thing, just transposed up or down.
[quote]gofunk (15/07/2010)[hr]Also I take it a whole tune dosent need to be it the same chord at the same time? ie I can have a pad with a minor chord and maybe a lead or stab sound on a major chord at the same time would this work or would it just sound confusing and crap?
[/quote]
you can change keys, but not have a lead in one scale and a bass in another. that would sound horrible. you could play a track in one key, and then change it at a particular part in your song. However, playing different keys at the same time, is pretty much a no no. Use your ears if you need reinforcement. 
[quote][b]you can change keys, but not have a lead in one scale and a bass in another. that would sound horrible. you could play a track in one key, and then change it at a particular part in your song. However, playing different keys at the same time, is pretty much a no no. Use your ears if you need reinforcement. [Smile]
[/quote]
Yeah I get that… so if say I’m playing one chord at one moment in time as a pad and I want to ad a lead, but lets say the lead is using only single notes/keys, would theses key need to be the same as the keys in the chord? My ears tell me I can change the single keys to any key in the scale right? not just the chord? Or am I best to avoid this?
I’m not the best at music theory and Howie would probably have a much better answer than I but yes you are correct.
If your playing a triad chord with your pad and your lead is made up of single notes they don’t necessarily have to be a note within the chord but they should be a note within the scale you are working in.
Of course even though you stay within a scale some combinations or intervals within the scale sound better than others and also it can be usefull to sharpen or flatten a note which would take you outside the scale (think incedentals). This could add tension to your sound. If your just starting out stick with the basic theory (stay within the scale) but do let your ears guide you.
Howie did a tutorial in which he shows how you could have the notes of a scale kind of like a template and hide all other notes in Ableton. It’s brilliant for a quick visual reference. Not sure if it’s still available but was really quite usefull.
I’ve been producing for a while now but always just went by ear and its done me proud so far however it can sometimes take forever to decide what keys I want and what goes with what etc so I’m hoping learning music theory will help me here.
The tutorail sounds good, Howie can you post a link please?
also how do you know if a chord is major or minor? thats confusing me
[quote]gofunk (15/07/2010)[hr]also how do you know if a chord is major or minor? thats confusing me[/quote]
can
it takes you ears and brain to remember how the chords sounds. I would suggest the first Music Theory in the videos. they explain very well what is the difference with the Major and Minor Keys .
Unfortunately, I dont have it anymore. Its easy though. If anyone has it, can they send it to him?
Its pretty simple, just requires a little prep. Find a list of scales somewhere. Online, wherever. Plug the scales in Ableton’s MIDI editor. Make the root note an 8th note and all the other notes 16th notes and do this all the way up the scale. Use C as the root note. You can do this for as many types of scales as you want. Locrian, Dorian, Pentataonic, whatever. When you have them all plugged in, highlight all the notes and drag them before 1.1. Then you click the FOLD button and only the notes that you would want to use are shown. The reason you drag the refrence notes before 1.1, is because you dont want them to actually play. You just want them for reference. If you want to keep the scale and change the key, click FOLD to unfold, highlight all the notes and hit the up or down arrow on your keyboard to move all the notes up or down by semitone. This way, you know that you are staying in key.
hope this helps!
Hey gofunk, since Howie gave his permission i don’t mind sending it to you. Just send me your email and I’ll send it to you.
[quote]gofunk (15/07/2010)[hr]also how do you know if a chord is major or minor? thats confusing me[/quote]
the 2nd note in a chord is what makes a triad chord major or minor… if the note “in the middle” of the 3 notes is 3 semi tones away from the 1st note (the root note) then the chord will be a minor chord… if the middle note is 4 semi tones away from the 1st note then its a major chord.
cool?
btw… what key you use means nothing… A#… F… C… Eb… it doesnt mean anything. if youve got a sample that you want to incorporate then youll obviously have to find the correct pitch but if youre making a track from scratch it dont matter. deciding whether to make the scale major or minor is the only descision youll have to make. i pretty much always use minor. most pop/disco tracks are minor.
[quote]rcorbo (15/07/2010)[hr]Hey gofunk, since Howie gave his permission i don’t mind sending it to you. Just send me your email and I’ll send it to you.[/quote]
fire it over to wayne@waynefontaine.co.uk please mate! Cheers 
[quote]jpgetty2win (15/07/2010)[hr][quote]gofunk (15/07/2010)[hr]also how do you know if a chord is major or minor? thats confusing me[/quote]
the 2nd note in a chord is what makes a triad chord major or minor… if the note “in the middle” of the 3 notes is 3 semi tones away from the 1st note (the root note) then the chord will be a minor chord… if the middle note is 4 notes away from the 1st note then its a major chord.
cool?
btw… what key you use means nothing… A#… F… C… Eb… it doesnt mean anything. if youve got a sample that you want to incorporate then youll obviously have to find the correct pitch but if youre making a track from scratch it dont matter. deciding whether to make the scale major or minor is the only descision youll have to make. i pretty much always use minor. most pop/disco tracks are minor.[/quote]
That helps re the chords. Cheers and yeah I’m aware of major and minor scales and also always use minor myself. but key does matter as you have to use the correct key in the scale… sorry for stating the obvious but just in case that confused anyone
when i said it doesnt matter what key to use i meant you dont have to sit there worry about or thinking about what key to use… A B D# F Bb they all the same… Youre not gonna get a different “feel” depending on the key you use. thats only when you write with modes. it only mattered years ago when writing for orchestras and also for vocalists when writing to the scales they can sing in (their range). for us it doesnt matter cos were mainly only using music and not using a vocalist thats gonna struggle to hit the top note.
but as i said, if youre using a sample them you gonna have to match the track to that samples key or change the key of the sample in a sampler (like you would when tuning a kick)
[quote]gofunk (15/07/2010)[hr][quote]rcorbo (15/07/2010)[hr]Hey gofunk, since Howie gave his permission i don’t mind sending it to you. Just send me your email and I’ll send it to you.[/quote]
fire it over to wayne@waynefontaine.co.uk please mate! Cheers
[/quote]
File sent to your email. Enjoy!
sweet, I’ll have a looksee when I finish work
Hey guys, see that tune I posted… well I think its in the D# minor scale, thats the scale I’m using on my latest work, I’m trying to get that nice dark emotion sound from the key played at the first part of the brake… trying alll diffrent chords in the scale, inverting them etc and I just cant seem to put my fingure on it. Any advice here or maybe it has to do with the sound I’m using or pitch or something???
Did you check out the video at all?
Thanks rcorbo! Can you send it back over to me?
fireing up my studio PC now so will check it out
[quote]gofunk (16/07/2010)[hr]Hey guys, see that tune I posted… well I think its in the D# minor scale, thats the scale I’m using on my latest work, I’m trying to get that nice dark emotion sound from the key played at the first part of the brake… trying alll diffrent chords in the scale, inverting them etc and I just cant seem to put my fingure on it. Any advice here or maybe it has to do with the sound I’m using or pitch or something???[/quote]
the first chord in the drop is D#m7 (imo).
[quote]howiegroove (16/07/2010)[hr]Did you check out the video at all?
Thanks rcorbo! Can you send it back over to me?[/quote]
Anytime dude! I just forwarded it to you Howie.