I as well as everyone here agree with Bobby.
Sorry Roben 
You need to protect yourself. Jon and I have talked about this, but I wont release my stuff to just any no name distributor. I want to know where my music is going, how they are going to promote it, and how much they are gonna pay me. PERIOD.
If you want to call me greedy, go right ahead. But if they like your song, the only reason thats possible is because they know they can make money off of it.
So the question standsā¦ do you want the money to go in your pocket, or to some record labels pocket?
In the right situation, both the artist AND the label will make money.
[quote]roben (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr]who are the label and what other tracks have they released?
which other artists do they have on their label?
website?
Promotion tactics?
Get as much info on them as you can, if nothing comes up to scratch ask for money upfront. if they canāt deliver artists, sales or a decent release and they are not prepared to pay you up front then they have nothing to offer you and are not gonna benefit you i any way what so ever.
[/quote]
+1 !!![/quote]
either iāve read this thread wrong or iāve worded what i have written wrong, but all the way through this thread you have been saying to send your tracks off and trust them!!! right ?? and iāve basically said if they canāt give you nothing **** them off and you now agree with me :blink:
[quote]howiegroove (18/08/2010)[hr]I as well as everyone here agree with Bobby.
Sorry Roben
You need to protect yourself. Jon and I have talked about this, but I wont release my stuff to just any no name distributor. I want to know where my music is going, how they are going to promote it, and how much they are gonna pay me. PERIOD.
If you want to call me greedy, go right ahead. But if they like your song, the only reason thats possible is because they know they can make money off of it.
So the question standsā¦ do you want the money to go in your pocket, or to some record labels pocket?
In the right situation, both the artist AND the label will make money.[/quote]
yes me and howard have spoken about this many times.
if you donāt give a **** about your music how its promoted or how much you make then just give it awayā¦
if not then they need to offer you something that is beneficial to youā¦ FOR EXAMPLE
- Have Big Name Djās Supporting the Label
- Have Big Name DJ/Producers on the label
- Make you Money through record sales
- Pay you money upfront
- Get you regular Paid Gigs
- The guys mum is gonna suck your balls twice a week
[quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]roben (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr]who are the label and what other tracks have they released?
which other artists do they have on their label?
website?
Promotion tactics?
Get as much info on them as you can, if nothing comes up to scratch ask for money upfront. if they canāt deliver artists, sales or a decent release and they are not prepared to pay you up front then they have nothing to offer you and are not gonna benefit you i any way what so ever.
[/quote]
+1 !!![/quote]
either iāve read this thread wrong or iāve worded what i have written wrong, but all the way through this thread you have been saying to send your tracks off and trust them!!! right ?? and iāve basically said if they canāt give you nothing **** them off and you now agree with me :blink:[/quote]
Maybe youāve read what iāve written wrong then?
Iāll C/P bits iāve wrote so maybe the double read might help:
ājust do a bit of research, google them.ā
āSend them the 320k mp3 file and then wait for them to send you a contract before you send them the .wav or the parts.ā
āObviously you want to check them out and obviously you donāt give them your .wav / parts till you see a contractā
There is no part in any of my posts iāve said to trust them, once youāve done your research there is no harm in sending the label a 320k file.
Iām not sure how youāve read any of my posts wrong?
So the fact that everyone disagrees with sending a label a 320k file is really interesting because when i worked as A&R i was sent 320k files all the time, we actually requested it. I couldnāt imagine listening to a 192k file or less to see whether weād want to sign the track or not?
Or is it a case of you send the label the 192 first then if they like it then you send them the 320k? Sounds a bit long winded.
I mean clearly anyone is going to do their research on the label before sending them anything anyways, thatās a given. But iām trying to get my head around the understanding that you wouldnāt send a label a 320k file??
Please explain.
delete double post
Sure why stop there? 
[quote]roben (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]roben (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr]who are the label and what other tracks have they released?
which other artists do they have on their label?
website?
Promotion tactics?
Get as much info on them as you can, if nothing comes up to scratch ask for money upfront. if they canāt deliver artists, sales or a decent release and they are not prepared to pay you up front then they have nothing to offer you and are not gonna benefit you i any way what so ever.
[/quote]
+1 !!![/quote]
either iāve read this thread wrong or iāve worded what i have written wrong, but all the way through this thread you have been saying to send your tracks off and trust them!!! right ?? and iāve basically said if they canāt give you nothing **** them off and you now agree with me :blink:[/quote]
Maybe youāve read what iāve written wrong then?
Iāll C/P bits iāve wrote so maybe the double read might help:
ājust do a bit of research, google them.ā
āSend them the 320k mp3 file and then wait for them to send you a contract before you send them the .wav or the parts.ā
āObviously you want to check them out and obviously you donāt give them your .wav / parts till you see a contractā
There is no part in any of my posts iāve said to trust them
Please explain.
[/quote]
Um yeah the bit about 4 sentences above the bold text.
im saying donāt give them **** until you know what they can give you. or until they have given it to you.
Why would you give someone a 320 mp3 when that is obviously good enough to play in the clubs or sell???
we all forget that you dont give labels parts
ever
the artist does the mix downs and the label only ever requests the wav file. why you would send them anything before you sign some paperwork is beyond me.
[quote]howiegroove (18/08/2010)[hr]we all forget that you dont give labels parts
ever
the artist does the mix downs and the label only ever requests the wav file. why you would send them anything before you sign some paperwork is beyond me.[/quote]
so true
[quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]
Why would you give someone a 320 mp3 when that is obviously good enough to play in the clubs or sell???[/quote]
Valid point, I guess there IS a degree of trust your giving, itās that degree of trust that they wonāt do that. However when youāve researched your label and see they have various releases on beatport / have good artists on their roster / blah de blah, then that kinda helps. But either way, no matter whatever happens, even with a contract, you still need to have some degree of trust with your label.
BTW allā¦ remember to QUADRUPLE check your contract and better stillā¦ get someone in the know to check it too before you sign anything (Que someone here to dissagree with me again).
[quote]howiegroove (18/08/2010)[hr]we all forget that you dont give labels parts
ever
.[/quote]
What about remixes?
[quote]
I mean clearly anyone is going to do their research on the label before sending them anything anyways, thatās a given. But iām trying to get my head around the understanding that you wouldnāt send a label a 320k file??
Please explain.
[/quote]
roben when you worked for the A&R company it was a big company that had a good client list. 99.9% of those releases where vinyl releases (we had this in another post) YES/NO?
so back then 320kbps Mp3 were of little interest to DJās and such but now with vinyl becoming the lesser media, 320 mp3 and wav become mainstream formatsā¦ and with that why would you give away something like that.
Back when your A&R company were doing vinyl releases if an artist had of showed up at your door with 5000 pressed vinyl and given them to you with out signing a thing your company would have ripped him off (you may not have wanted anything to do with it but your company would have)
Just thought iād bring in some posts that Bryan made in another thread, they may be useful of the thread starter. As well as for the fact a lot of what you guys are posting seems to contradict what Bryan says which in turn, just confuses matters for the rest of us.
[quote]bryan spence (05/08/2010)[hr][quote]gofunk (04/08/2010)[hr][quote]bryan spence (03/08/2010)[hr]agreed,
send your details and wait for the contract, if they dont get it to you in a bit then chase them up.
labels get a lot of stuff sent through so youāve got to expect delays[/quote]
yeah I was more concerned about how fast they got back to me as thats unusual! Iāve asked to review the contract in detail prior to sending any remix pack so on sat so Iāll hold off and seeā¦ I wanna wait anyway to see what the others say and for some of the bigger labels it may even take a month before they get back to you from the initail submission.[/quote]
theres no need to be suspicious. most labels are genuine.
just donāt expect to make any money from it if you arenāt getting an advance 
a lot of them like to give you a split, but you rarely see any of it unfortunately.
its a good name building exercise however, you have got to start somewhere[/quote]
[quote]bryan spence (09/08/2010)[hr]if you are new to the scene, i donāt think you can expect anything more than Ā£150 for an advance.
it all depends how much faith you have that your track will sell.
if its a big label then you should see some money coming in from your %.
although if its a big label you should also expect an advance.
basically if your track only sells 50-100 copies, and you are contracted to 50/50 splits.
that is - taking 70 copies as the sale - 70 x Ā£1.99 = Ā£139
minus the site that is selling its cut @ about 50% = Ā£69 for the label.
which leaves you with Ā£34
most labels will have it stipulated that you will only get paid when your cut is over for example Ā£50 or Ā£100.
and some of them write your cut off against āPRā etc.
so you simply may just never see your share.
so that is why its hard to get an advance. the label have got to be confident that your track will sell Ā£600 worth - or over 300 copies before its worth their while to give you a Ā£150 advance.
nothing to get disheartened about - as i say its a name building exercise - and you never know. you may sell 3000 copies. at which point you will be getting a cheque for your share.
[/quote]
[quote]bryan spence (09/08/2010)[hr]and what i said about most labels being genuine - most are. but there are still some dodgy ones out there.
the whole scene seems unregulated at the minute.
i have for example 3 tracks for sale on beatport and itunes, that i never agreed to sell. nor did i provide them with the files.
my track got lifted by a label who took it upon themselves to sell it to another label - but not after selling it on their own first.
none of which will take it down. - and Apple are about as useful as a wet fish about getting it removed.
so - long story short. most are genuine - some are not :)[/quote]
[quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]
I mean clearly anyone is going to do their research on the label before sending them anything anyways, thatās a given. But iām trying to get my head around the understanding that you wouldnāt send a label a 320k file??
Please explain.
[/quote]
roben when you worked for the A&R company it was a big company that had a good client list. 99.9% of those releases where vinyl releases (we had this in another post).
[/quote]
NO, they used to sell mostly vinyl some years before i started, but bear it mind it was only a couple of years ago, a lot of releases were digital along with only a small few hundred (if any at all) being vinyl.
you still would never give the stems for remixes. now, if you want someone to remix your project, then yes, you will need to bounce stems. however, this will only happen if they ask you for the stems.
[quote]roben (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]
Why would you give someone a 320 mp3 when that is obviously good enough to play in the clubs or sell???[/quote]
Valid point, I guess there IS a degree of trust your giving, itās that degree of trust that they wonāt do that. However when youāve researched your label and see they have various releases on beatport / have good artists on their roster / blah de blah, then that kinda helps. But either way, no matter whatever happens, even with a contract, you still need to have some degree of trust with your label.
BTW allā¦ remember to QUADRUPLE check your contract and better stillā¦ get someone in the know to check it too before you sign anything (Que someone here to dissagree with me again).
[/quote]
yeah but if they already have a release and top artists they know how it goes. nothing happens until contract is signedā¦
Btw if the label has approached you then theyāve already heard your track and the already like it (apparently) why would they then request a better quality version with out showing the cash dude
Money talks and bull**** walks bro
āi have for example 3 tracks for sale on beatport and itunes, that i never agreed to sell. nor did i provide them with the files.ā
This bit that Bryan says does interest / concern me however, does tie up nicely with what you were saying Jon about sending labels your 320.
Definitely food for thought!!
[quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr]
if you donāt give a **** about your music how its promoted or how much you make then just give it awayā¦
if not then they need to offer you something that is beneficial to youā¦ FOR EXAMPLE
1. Have Big Name Djās Supporting the Label
2. Have Big Name DJ/Producers on the label
3. Make you Money through record sales
4. Pay you money upfront
5. Get you regular Paid Gigs
6. The guys mum is gonna suck your balls twice a week[/quote]
Iād settle for no.6
So whereās the line, where is the happy medium? How do you know how to be really safe?
Itās definitely a dog eat dog world, and people are definitely out to f*ck you. BUT how do you know youāre not being TOO cautious and just shooting yourself in the foot?
[quote]roben (18/08/2010)[hr]So whereās the line, where is the happy medium? How do you know how to be really safe?
Itās definitely a dog eat dog world, and people are definitely out to f*ck you. BUT how do you know youāre not being TOO cautious and just shooting yourself in the foot?
[/quote]
dude its simple the second you sign a contract saying we will give you blah blah blah and youāre happy with it you giveā¦
donāt go giving anything a second before you have to.
[quote]Kieran Mach (18/08/2010)[hr][quote]jon_fisher (18/08/2010)[hr]
if you donāt give a **** about your music how its promoted or how much you make then just give it awayā¦
if not then they need to offer you something that is beneficial to youā¦ FOR EXAMPLE
- Have Big Name Djās Supporting the Label
- Have Big Name DJ/Producers on the label
- Make you Money through record sales
- Pay you money upfront
- Get you regular Paid Gigs
- The guys mum is gonna suck your balls twice a week[/quote]
Iād settle for no.6[/quote]
me too